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TOPIC: Next purchase ... need ideas

Re:Re: Re:Re: Re:Re: Next purchase ... need ideas 2 months 1 week ago #17501

  • Bushwhacked
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LeoBarr wrote:
You will only alter the angle when it is desired to change it for strops .
I don't have this accessory yet but it works in a similar way to the drill stop collar on the Edge Pro . What you do is set the angle perhaps with the 1K diamond adjust the VSTA for this stone by butting the plate up to the face of the stone and lock it off this provides the constant. Then you may go to your starting stone and set up the stone angle to but up to the VSTA and lock it off this will have set the stone up at an identical angle to the stone that you initially set up ; then with each change of stone you repeat the process until you get to stops then you reset the stone arm at the desired angle against the knife then but it up against the VSTA and now you have your next constant for the strops .
It sounds a lot more complicated than it actually is I am not sure if Clay or anyone has made a vid of it yet.
Suffice to say if I wrote out how you make a cup of coffee from start to finish even instant coffee it would still be a long dialogue - find kettle is there water is there power -no water fill it up no power plug it in it would sound way more difficult than it is take it from me it is the WE version of the Edge Pro drill stop collar and if you have not used it it can be hard to see how it functions but it is simplicity itself I think at the moment not having used either it is hard to grab just how simple and well it works .
I relate to this since I had a similar problem with the drill stop collar until I actually used it then it became clear just how it works .
I am sure you have read or heard Clay's advice that with strops you drop the angle by 2˚ so that you do not round off the tip of the bevel since the strops tend to curl around the apex of the bevel in use if you do not reduce the angle if they do curl over the edge then you will remove the apex of the bevel.
Many of these thing require building a mental picture of the mechanics of the whole thing the same way an engineer will understand and see the internal movements of an engine .
There is to coin a phrase and I am not meaning it in a derogatory way to anyone least of all you - but there is no white mans' magic to this its pure science .
Lastly you only need to reset the angle going to strops it does not matter if you go from diamonds to ceramics or Choseras since you will only wish to change the angle for the strops. All you do is but up each stone to the VSTA every change of stone.
It will all become crystal when you have them (VSTAs).


Thanks for that ... So are the VSTAs a must have? I have done a lot of reading and you said as well that you only change the angle with strops. I have read that as well ... Then we got on the top of thickness and all that and needing to change your angles with more addons and more $$ I am just not wanting to spend more money after my recent purchase of blocks. I'd like to use them and be perfectly fine with my results and not upset that I still need more gear to help sharpen after I've bought the complete system. If it's a must it should of came with it to begin with I feel.

I was planning on switching the angle when I started stropping but never thought I would need to check after every switch of blocks.
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Re:Re: Re:Re: Re:Re: Next purchase ... need ideas 2 months 1 week ago #17502

  • Mikedoh
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Bushwhacked wrote:
Mikedoh wrote:
The Variable Stone Thickness Adaptor is a worthwhile accessory, especially when you get into water stones. I have water stones from my EP, Chosera stones purchased for the EP, and an 8k Naniwa stone on a WE paddle. Lots of different stone thicknesses. Very nice to only need to set the angle once ( for a given angle) on each side than constant fiddling with the angle cube with each "stone" change.

So you're saying you just set the angle and go? Do you change angle from ceramic to leather and things like that?

With any change of paddle/stone, you simply mate it up to the face of the VSTA, that you set into position when you chose your sharpening angle.

For a visual, say you have 2 different thickness of stones, one 1/4 inch thick, the other, 1/2 inch thick. If you don't compensate for the difference in thickness (by using either the angle cube or the VSTA) your angle will be different with each stone. The VSTA allows for quick adjustment for varying thicknesses without having to repeatedly use the angle cube.

It is not necessary, but it is nice. If you are using water stones , it is very helpful.
I drove a manual transmission in my second to last pick up for 232k miles. In heavy stop and go traffic jams, especially those lasting an hour or two, an automatic would have been nice, but not necessary.
Last Edit: 2 months 1 week ago by Mikedoh.
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Re:Re: Re:Re: Re:Re: Next purchase ... need ideas 2 months 1 week ago #17503

  • LeoBarr
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The VSTAs are a very new product they were only released this year perhaps they will eventually be included in the standard package .
I am afraid that sharpening is like that period even with freehand sharpening there is always another stone ,film, emulsion , paste or strop to get.
Then as you get more into it you realise you need perhaps the mechanical help of a belt sander it does not stop.
You can do it without the VSTAs since the stones reduce very slightly relative to the size of the diamonds so you don't need the VSTAs for them but they are handy for the ceramics and the Choseras where they will wear at different rates .
SO in your natural progression at the moment you will have to correct the angle with each change of ceramic and with each change of the Choseras and the strops the VSTA is a fantastic aid that saves time .
You and many other sharpen very precisely without them I do not have them yet either .
But since I initially ordered and received my WE there has been the Low angle adapter , the VSTA, the chisel holder and I suspect not too far away the scissor adapter the product is evolving the greater the number the greater demands become apparent which evolves the tool.
There are many other modifications which would be desirable but if you incorporated them all the machine would be made of many more materials demanding much finer tolerances which would no doubt double the price.
I believe you have a very good platform to start on let it grow as your proficiency grows . I would say to get really good at it you will need to do at least 100 knives by then you will have a clearer idea of what you want out of it and where to spend the money on extras .
It has been suggested that if you have too many toys shall we say it is harder to see your progress so as an entry keep it simple this way you will get the most out of it .
It relates to what is sharp your EDC does not need to be hair splitting sharp if it was it will not perform well for everyday tasks it just won't have the bite.
I have seen many blades with mirror finished bevels that will just not cut because the profile is too broad for example you can cut carrots with a plasterers spatular because it is thin . You could sharpen an axe to razor sharp and it would not cut a carrot but smash it .
I think as a possible beginner to sharpening those are really much more relevant than perfect mirror finished bevels the primary bevel should be minute even if it is a mirror about 1/32 of an inch per side is good with a very low wide second at (thinning) bevel .
So please do not get frustrated over what you have not yet got get to understand profile and blade geometry this is what really makes a knife perform.
Speaking from my own experience these were the points that took the longest to grasp .
Last word like everything in life there is no limit to what you can learn about sharpening a Master Samurai sharpener trains for 10 years and is never absolutely happy with their work as a master.
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Re:Re: Re:Re: Re:Re: Next purchase ... need ideas 2 months 1 week ago #17504

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I agree with you Leo ... I have sharpened plenty of knives on other sharpeners, but from what I've seen the WE gave me everything I wanted. I went ahead and picked up an angle cube since they are cheap just to help with the angles ... I think now I will be happy with the setup for awhile until I feel I need a new level of polished haha. But like your said ... About a 100 knives to figure out what I like and learn my tools. I think now with those setup I'll be happy working on 100 knives...
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Re:Re: Re:Re: Re:Re: Next purchase ... need ideas 2 months 1 week ago #17505

  • LeoBarr
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I am pleased to have been of help - sharpening in whatever medium you use is a big rabbit hole I regularly have to stop myself from getting more stuff .
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Re:Re: Re:Re: Re:Re: Next purchase ... need ideas 2 months 1 week ago #17506

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LeoBarr wrote:
I am pleased to have been of help - sharpening in whatever medium you use is a big rabbit hole I regularly have to stop myself from getting more stuff .

Haha yes it is ... I really hope I am satisfied with my new setup enough I can stop and save for awhile haha
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Next purchase ... need ideas 2 months 1 week ago #17508

  • EamonMcGowan
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I am late to the conversation. But could not agree with Leo more!! Learn the tool first, then buy all the goodies! I did not really follow that advice but it is great advice!
Within a month I had bought the chosera's and on to the ceramics. Since my purchase Pro pack 1? I am on my second set of diamonds, need new low grit chosera's ect... :ohmy:
My point being I did not need any of it to get great edges for my EDC knives! In fact Leo is right as you will hear Josh say too, you need the diamonds for a good toothy edge to really cut everyday stuff. Yes the chrome like edges are great. :woohoo: Real show stoppers and all your friends will be totally amazed!! ;) My friends think I know what I'm doing? HA HA LOL!! It is the system!!! (well maybe a little bit?)
The thing is you do not need anything outside of Pro Pack 1. Period! The rest is just gravy and feeding our OCD. :P (But lets face it if you did not have OCD you would never have bought the system in the first place :sick:)
So sit back and sharpen knives till your hear is content! One day you will say to yourself, hey I didn't have to think about it and I was not worried if I was going to slow? Slow down, relax and just have fun! B)
The definition of insanity is to do the same thing over and over again and expect a different result?
An old Irish toast, May the wind always be at your back, may you always have work and may you be in heaven a half hour before the devil knows your dead. Cheers!
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