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TOPIC: diamond vs naniwa super vs ceramic vs shapton etc

Re: diamond vs naniwa super vs ceramic vs shapton etc 1 year 10 months ago #5068

  • KenBuzbee
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So the first question I have (which, as you say, Phil, may not get much input) is regarding the Naniwa Super Stone.... Tom mentions Chosera stones form a paste while Shaptons form a swarf. Paste - good.... Swarf - bad. Which, if either, do the Naniwas form?

Ken
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Re: diamond vs naniwa super vs ceramic vs shapton etc 1 year 10 months ago #5070

  • cbwx34
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The ones I've tried freehand.... swarf. They're a hard stone that don't break down easily. You can always lap one with a nagura or fine diamond stone to create a little paste (mud), if desired.
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Re: diamond vs naniwa super vs ceramic vs shapton etc 1 year 10 months ago #5072

  • StevenPinson
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KenBuzbee wrote:
So the first question I have (which, as you say, Phil, may not get much input) is regarding the Naniwa Super Stone.... Tom mentions Chosera stones form a paste while Shaptons form a swarf. Paste - good.... Swarf - bad. Which, if either, do the Naniwas form?

Ken

Nania SS will form a paste or will not form a paste depending on how "YOU" use them. They are a splash and go stone. Keep them wet and they will provide a nice paste base that will polish very well. Let them dry as you use them, and they will start to cut and impinge.

I have used the SS line for quite a while now and for the cost/performance they are very tough to beat.
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Re: diamond vs naniwa super vs ceramic vs shapton etc 1 year 10 months ago #5073

  • PhilipPasteur
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Just a clarification, and probably an important one. I go from the 1000 diamonds to 400 choseras. Then 600, 800, 1000, 2000. After the 3000 chosera (recently) I tried going to the 5K Shapton. Seemst to work fine in the progression and I like the way it feels better than the 5K chosera. Again recently, and probably just because I bought the stones and have been trying them out, I replaced the 5K, 10K choseras with the Sahpton 5k (as just mentioned) the 10K Naniwa, the 12K Superstone then the 15K Shapton. Similar to what Tom has said, the Sahpton at 400X show mor of a regular scratch pattern then the 10K chosera , but does not leave the edge as reflective (pretty). Then I go to strops. I don't go back and forth between diamonds and stones nor stones and strops. BTW, if you strop, the final refinement and character of the edge end up being a result of the stopping process. This can be seen under the microscope and felt in use.

Check out this thread:
www.wickededgeusa.com/index.php?option=c...=5&id=2399&Itemid=63

Now if we get, through stropping, to a place where we can see no scratches at 500X, how significant is the finishing stone that we used prior to stropping, much less the progression that we used before that finishing stone ??

The original question was whether ..if one was to use a Naniwa for finishing, then was it required to use the Naniwas for the previous several grits. I have read many people's opinions that state that you need to stay withing a specific brand, or type of stone for a progression, to get good results. I just don't happen to agree. Lots of the razor guys go from Kings or Nortons at 8K to the 12K SS and then the 15K and 30K Shaptons, and love the results. Of course, they also always strop. But what better way to rate an edge than to scrape your face with it :)

Japanese sword polishers mix natural stones mined in different place all over Japan, They don't have a brand, nor are they of a fixed grit. If you look at their work, it is had to agrue that their method does not work.

In a bit I will try to tackle the part of the OP question about the differences in different types of stones/plates rated with the same grit number.

Phil
Phil

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Last Edit: 1 year 10 months ago by PhilipPasteur.
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Re: diamond vs naniwa super vs ceramic vs shapton etc 1 year 10 months ago #5074

  • cbwx34
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StevenPinson wrote:
Nania SS will form a paste or will not form a paste depending on how "YOU" use them.
Totally agree with that. Most stones can be made to perform different ways, depending on how you use them.
PhilipPasteur wrote:
The original question was whether ..if one was to use a Naniwa for finishing, then was it required to use the Naniwas for the previous several grits. I have read many people's opinions that state that you need to stay withing a specific brand, or type of stone for a progression, to get good results. I just don't happen to agree. Lots of the razor guys go from Kings or Nortons at 8K to the 12K SS and then the 15K and 30K Shaptons, and love the results. Of course, they also always strop. But what better way to rate an edge than to scrape your face with it :)

Japanese sword polishers mix natural stones mined in different place all over Japan, They don't have a brand, nor are they of a fixed grit. If you look at their work, it is had to agrue that their method does not work.

Well said, and I agree with you on this... I kinda get the impression you think I don't? Like I said, I think it's just a general recommendation... not a hard and fast rule... certainly not a requirement. I too, will often switch to a different type of finishing stone, depending on the results I want.
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Re: diamond vs naniwa super vs ceramic vs shapton etc 1 year 10 months ago #5076

  • PhilipPasteur
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Hi CBWX..
It is all good. You mentioned a few things that made me feel like I needed to clarify what I had said previously. The idea being to no mislead Ken.

Interesting thing about the Internet. You get one person that is respected say something, then everybody starts saying the same thing over and over. Yes the common wisdom seems to be that you "NEED" an entire set of stones from the same brand/line or no one can get good results. Logic says otherwise...

Just a pet peeve of mine... nothing personal.
:)

Phil
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I miss you Buddy!
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